King Of The Lake Spring and Fall

[getitwet]

Hey Tony

Yes it is true that you cn't keep your fish in a livewell full of water or alive.  But you can keep them in the livewell with the proper icedown techniques.  This has made everyone level on how to handle fish.

[SpoonPullers.com]

[TyeeTanic]

Hey Tony

Yes it is true that you cn't keep your fish in a livewell full of water or alive.  But you can keep them in the livewell with the proper icedown techniques.  This has made everyone level on how to handle fish.

For a newbie, what is the main reason for this?

[tonyb]

Hey Tony

Yes it is true that you cn't keep your fish in a livewell full of water or alive.  But you can keep them in the livewell with the proper icedown techniques.  This has made everyone level on how to handle fish.

For a newbie, what is the main reason for this?

To level the playing field.  When fish are kept in a livewell they are submerged in water (and could potentially weigh heavier than if they weren't submerged), in a cooler with ice & drain they are not submerged or as wet.

We used to keep the fish we caught in the livewell and have a rubbermaid tote we would keep filled with water at the dock so it wouldn't blow away during the day when we were fishing.  Once we returned to port we would then dump the water out of the rubbermaid tote and transfer the fish to the tote to carry over to the weigh in...pure Ghetto style  ...those big ass coolers are expensive hehehe

[Digby]

I am a firm believer that less is more. I can run a comfortable 10 rod spread on my rig, but have had awesome days running 6 rods or less. Some of the best days have been running two wire and two riggers! Sometimes I will also run copper or leadcore on my outriggers. Tough to do in combat fishing though!

[Witching Hour]

Yvan (with a "Y" ... LOL),
I have heard the misnomer that small boats can't compete against big boats in the KOTL. I think many good anglers have closed the door on that theory over the years (although boat / troll may be better in a larger boat ... a whole other topic though).
I think a big part of that is the intimidation factor ... small boat competing against "animals" like GetItWet / Thrillseeker / Vision Quest / Moby Nick / Royal Flush / Pressman, etc, etc.
A fellow may say ... how can I compete against these "animals" OR "Super Heros?!" [No joke ... they are Super Heros of the Lake Ontario Salmon World BTW ... they eat brined anchovies for breakfast! If I had kids and these guys had "players cards" I'd buy for my kids! LOL.]
All of the organizers of the event / anglers are very friendly and welcoming.
I think this board discussion / new preposed changes / new hightened awareness / will get those guys sitting "on the fence"  to sign up next yr... 

Cheers,
J
 

[riggermortis]

Just to be clear on my point we're not intimidated at all fishing against bigger boats we've been lucky enough to place well ahead of many in smaller tourneys the last couple yrs. Point I was trying to make was it's hard for a lot of guys in smaller boats to send in large entry fees well in advance not knowing what the lake will be like. Only guys that ever seem to slap that fact aside are in big boats.

[tonyb]

Yvan (with a "Y" I might add ... LOL),
I have heard the misnomer that small boats can't compete against big boats in the KOTL. I think many good anglers have closed the door on that theory over the years.
I think a big part of that is the intimidation factor ... small boat competing against "animals" like GetItWet / Thrillseeker / Vision Quest / Moby Nick / Royal Flush / Pressman, etc, etc.
A fellow may say ... how can I compete against these "animals" OR "Super Heros?!" [No joke ... they are Super Heros of the Lake Ontario Salmon World BTW ... they eat brined anchovies for breakfast!]
All of the organizers of the event / anglers are very friendly and welcoming.
I think this board discussion / new preposed changes / new hightened awareness / will get those guys sitting "on the fence"  to sign up next yr... 

Cheers,
J

LOL Salmon Super Heroes!

Small boats fish less effectively in borderline small craft warning weather period.  It's not a question of angler skill, but wind/waves works against the smaller, lighter boats by degrading effective boat control.

Boat size aside, I believe what seperates the consistent winners is time on the water, experience, and confidence in your own strategy. 

I would say that the 'intimidation factor' (if you want to call it that) for me personally is that I can't dedicate the time to sufficiently pre-fish each event.  In my view, without somewhat extensive pre-fishing it is difficult to know where the active fish are, how they are moving based on prevailing weather, and build a program custom tailored to your boat/style. 

Hmm...a thought just occurred to me, maybe that is how you could define a 'pro'?  If your pre-fishing day count exceeds your regular day job count on the week leading up to a major tournament Certainly if your regular day job IS pre-fishing 

Just to be clear on my point we're not intimidated at all fishing against bigger boats we've been lucky enough to place well ahead of many in smaller tourneys the last couple yrs. Point I was trying to make was it's hard for a lot of guys in smaller boats to send in large entry fees well in advance not knowing what the lake will be like. Only guys that ever seem to slap that fact aside are in big boats.

Agreed, realistically for the KOTL since you must register ahead of time, you should be in a vessel that allows you to be comfortable fishing in anything up to a Small Craft Warning (Not just an advisory)

I believe that is when they would cancel an event, if there was a Small Craft Warning.
Tony

[moemoe]

I am one of the guys that is new to the tournament series, fishing a few of the events. I think this is fantastic that Yvan is having communication regarding this topic. From my experience, the tournament itself is well run. Weighin is still relatively quick and smooth in my opinion. One suggestion for me would be to have the captains meeting directly after the big fish friday weigh in, intead of waiting around till 6pm. I feel the lead up to the tournament can be improved on. The King of the lake website hasn't really been updated in 2 years, and things even like registration deadlines and times of captains meetings are not listed. I understand usually they are the same from tournie to tournie, but for new groups interested like myself, it would be nice if there was more info availaible. Not to slam Yvan, but in a tourney where you an electronic weigh in system and calculation, I don't understnd why the final results arent updated anywhere, it was odd that the only real info out there post tournie was the calcutta results, with detailed payouts, that dday posted here after day 1 and day 2.

Fishing these things in a smaller boat, the only intimidation I get is from the weather. It sucks to have to payout the cash and not be able to get where you want to go, but that is a learning process as well. I love the idea of having the lower entry fee, ie $400, plus the option of the 2 calcuttas. Afte not paying the 100$ for the tightltine calcutta, and regretting it, I was convinced not to miss out on it again, but a calcutta of 200 each day for the fall scotty was a little too rich for me. For all the guys concerned about the small boat factor, pressman is out there competing in a 19 foot boat, so it can be done successfully.

I love the competetion of these events, and it's humbling sometimes as well, as I still have a lot to learn to be consistent. It's great to have something like this organized, kudos to yvan for that

[visionquest]

Lots of good thoughts.

Not to be the referee here, but were just talking fishing here..  Keep it cool, were all just trying to give our own input for a good reason and because Yvan wants to here it (good, bad or indifferent)

8 rods vs. 6 topic: In an 8 rod event, we do NOT always run 8.  Sometimes, the extra rods get in the way, get tangled and cost one a fish, fishing time (tangles) and bites... The 6 vs. 8 is a pretty tough argument to win/lose and it really boils down to.. Does one realy want to fish the event to begin with?  If so, then they will roll with the rules...Then choose the most effective program for their boat/crew/conditions.  There are days on a tough bite where 15 rods would not make much of a diff. and days when you can't keep 6 wet...
Having different events with some different rules keeps it interesting. My 2 cents.

Titelines is 6. OK.  Thats the rule.  No complaints.  Would 8 be better? Yep, but thats the rule I signed up for and I better make em all count. LOL

Small boat vs. big: Another tough argument or what not...  Big boats in skinny water=bad,  Big boats that have to run a great distance=bad.  Big boats fuel bill after a weekend event in which they had to run far=doubly bad. Big boats in 4-8 ft. seas=good. Small boats have their advantages and as mentioned, there are many good teams putting a beat down on the fish in small boats.  We know who they are...  It can and does get done.

As said in another thread, Capt. V.P. of Thrillseeker and I always commented on the attitudes of the Canadian guys we see who have smaller rigs.  Its the "just bring it" attitude and the attitude that were gonna beat you even if you have your big battleships over here. LOL..  We can appreciate that Spirit and love to compete in that environment where it exists.

Were a part time crew that travels to Lake O. to battle with the locals on your Lake, your ports and against your communication network.  Toss the Erie rods and walleye gear off the boat and load up the salmon gear with the dust on it.. We usually have to dial in a program within a couple days. (NOT EASY) and no one sends us the Memo stating where the fish are and what their eating. LOL . In fact, Yvan usually tells us the fish are opposite of where their usually at, so we figd his scheme out and go opposite of where he tells us to go.  Or if he says the bite is a grind, we know It's GOOD    We come against greater odds but come cuz we just like to compete, love to see everyone and the atmosphere and anticipation is hard to duplicate.

Keep the thoughts coming.  There good for everyone to see and maybe when its all said and done, Yvan and others can help their events be what the fisherman really want?

Where can we send our entry fee to?

Captain Pete
Vision Quest

[Yankee Troller]

I would say that the 'intimidation factor' (if you want to call it that) for me personally is that I can't dedicate the time to sufficiently pre-fish each event.  In my view, without somewhat extensive pre-fishing it is difficult to know where the active fish are, how they are moving based on prevailing weather, and build a program custom tailored to your boat/style.

Most boats only pre-fish one day with a few getting in two. We are one boat who only gets in one day of pre-fish for Canadian events. We do OK, but we've never cashed in a KOTL event. However, we have done well in Toronto with one day of practice over the last two years going 3 for 3 on checks. With that being said our only tourney win was Orleans 2007, and we won with NO practice and a 25' boat. Remember that things change daily. What you did two days ago rarely will result in similar results.

[John Whyte]

It seems entry fees are a topic for all species tournaments these days. I believe the state of the economy and cost of fuel is the major stressor. After all is said and done if you live far enough away that travel and accommodations come in to play, the entry fee becomes the smallest component of the total cost. Lower entry might help most but the payout structure has to be able to support a healthy percentage of anglers with the chance of breaking even. In smaller tournaments with low entry fees you might have to win to break even.

I guess there is a balance between wanting to afford and can't afford that will entice more anglers to commit to tournaments again. Everything seems to be last minute these days and it is tough to organize and get sponsorship for that type of commitment. 

[barts]

I really like the 6 rod idea but 8 won't stop us.  A good point made with the observer.  It would crowd the smaller boats.  I also like the idea DDay had about the 2 seperate calcuttas.  If you want to pay a bit more and play with the big boys that is a personal option.  I like lots of the ideas here.  I however don't like the option of having the choice of fishing 1 or 2 days.  If you are going to fish a tourney then you should fish both days.  Just my 2 cents. when can I send a cheque for spring?

[tyee3904]

Yes, i would be more interested if it was 6 rods that's forsure.
It does not make much sence to get into something and pay the same fee when you start at a disadvantage (3 man team or less).
Sure it is supposed to be fun, but everyone is in it to win i.m.o.
As i have broke down on day one in the past after 15 mins of fishing it would be nice if there was a draw prize of some kind for the rest of the field to be in that does not finish in the money.
That way every team that enters has a chance to win something even if you break down..........
One thing that would be nice is to have something given back to the fisherman from the "sponcers", i currently have never seen this but have heard of sponcers supporting the tournament, but how?
Not trying to cause a problem but when entering something that is sponcered it would be nice for the participants to also know the payouts before hand as well.
As it seems to be it's 100 percent payout from the fisherman's money and nothing from the "sponcers"...........

[darkfisher]

Not really at a disadvantage.  we fish an 18 foot lund.  normally finishing in the top 20.  the fishing in the spring and the fall can happen in shallow water and 8 rods will often put you at a disadvantage.  untangling lines and crisscrossing fish when the bite gets hot.  we tried to fish 8 in the spring derby but the fishing was so good we never got over 6 and we still boated over 65 kings in 2 days.  8 can easily be done in a small boat.  I believe that if you can't catch 5 fish in 8 hours on six rods 8 wouldn't be much more help.  This is a great tourney and I think everyone should give it a shot you never know when it's going to be your day.  I think the lower entry fees would help but that being said 650 for the weekend plus some gas usually works out to 200 bucks a person.  can't beat that for a weekend of fun and the prizes stay nice and high. I'll be there next year no matter what.

[chadk]

If you are looking for new blood, consider two tiers based on size of boat.  Can't picture four people in an 18' lund in 3-5' waves trying to run eight rods.  Tier #1 for boats 25' or larger.  Higher entry fee, bigger payout.  Eight rods.  Tier #2 for boats smaller than 25'.  Lower entry fee, smaller payout and six rods.  If someone wants to run their 18' boat with the big boys....let them.  Nice to have a choice.